OkieTigerTK

And So It Begins... (LSU will NOT fire any Baseball Coaches)

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the sky is not falling. but just like fb when the sky was not falling, adjustments needed to be made. changes in asst coaches in a few areas really improved things there. it isnt about throwing a fit we didnt win it all, it is "where can we improve and how?"

We didn't finish strong but we won the SEC, hosted a Super and ran into a buzz saw and a little bad luck at the end. It's very similar to our Fb year which was all we could ask for except a very bad ending. I look at the improvement from last year and see a program heading in a good direction. Edited by SabanFan

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I agree, and the numbers say y'all are all looking at the wrong guy.

we may be and i am feeling you are right. But that puts us back to do we take a chance with an alleva hire, whuch scares the crap out of me, or do we try to make more minor changes, or do we leave all alone and hope for the best?

And in reality it is gonna be the latter because it is obvious no changes are gonna be made.

Oh, and i look at the pitching coach change and see improvement there, so that is a change that i am pleased we made and i think is what contributed towards the improvement this year.

Edited by OkieTigerTK

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But Mainieri wasn't calling pitches before, and he ain't calling them now.

If you can convince me the Mainieri isn't making the strategic decision when we're at bat, i'll lean more toward the "Fire Javi" bandwagon.

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we may be and i am feeling you are right. But that puts us back to do we take a chance with an alleva hire, whuch scares the crap out of me, or do we try to make more minor changes, or do we leave all alone and hope for the best?

At the moment, we leave well enough alone.

But not because of fear of Alleva.

We do it, because our season was too good to justify firing the head guy.

A conference title, national seed, and 1 game from Omaha is not a disaster.

Y'all hope the change is in the coaching staff.

I hope the change is in overall baseball philosophy and/or types of athletes recruited.

When I say we need to add power, I'm not just talking about roping homers off the intimidator.

We also need guys who hit grounders up the middle with enough pep to get past the average SEC shortstop, or whose liners are traveling fast enough that OF don't get there in time.

We currently don't really have those guys.

We have a bunch of singles hitter who have to find empty space, because they can't muscle their way on base.

And then when they get on base, they really ain't fast enough to cause any damage.

We are completely 1 dimensional.

That's not a good thing in any sport.

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If baseball went to the CWS Finals and got crushed, that'd be different.

Losing at home to Stony Brook is not the same as LSU losing to Alabama in a sport where there is very little parity.

LSU hasn't been in the top 8 in 1,000 days.

They used to win 2-3 national titles in 1,000 days.

Currently, South Carolina is doing the same.

If SabanFan is content being ranked 12th, that's fine. I expect a little more.

Winning the SEC, being the No. 7 seed, etc... it's all garbage if you don't make it to Omaha.

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If baseball went to the CWS Finals and got crushed, that'd be different.

Losing at home to Stony Brook is not the same as LSU losing to Alabama in a sport where there is very little parity.

LSU hasn't been in the top 8 in 1,000 days.

They used to win 2-3 national titles in 1,000 days.

Currently, South Carolina is doing the same.

If SabanFan is content being ranked 12th, that's fine. I expect a little more.

Winning the SEC, being the No. 7 seed, etc... it's all garbage if you don't make it to Omaha.

it's not THAT we didn't make the CWS that upsets me.

it's how we did it.

it's looking at the roster and being able to predict exactly what was going to be our undoing.

and by looking at the roster, i mean looking at it last year, I could see where we would struggle this year.

and now i'm looking at what is probably going to be a rebuilding year.

we lose our ace.

Nola will probably assume that role, but I don't see anyone on the roster I'm comfortable with for the rest of the weekend.

I would slide Cotton into Goody's role.

then you have to replace the entire left side of the defense.

the best left side we've had since Barbier/Theriot in 2000.

I want to see some more pop and some more speed in the lineup.

as well as plug some holes in the pitching staff.

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At the moment, we leave well enough alone.

But not because of fear of Alleva.

We do it, because our season was too good to justify firing the head guy.

A conference title, national seed, and 1 game from Omaha is not a disaster.

Y'all hope the change is in the coaching staff.

I hope the change is in overall baseball philosophy and/or types of athletes recruited.

When I say we need to add power, I'm not just talking about roping homers off the intimidator.

We also need guys who hit grounders up the middle with enough pep to get past the average SEC shortstop, or whose liners are traveling fast enough that OF don't get there in time.

We currently don't really have those guys.

We have a bunch of singles hitter who have to find empty space, because they can't muscle their way on base.

And then when they get on base, they really ain't fast enough to cause any damage.

We are completely 1 dimensional.

That's not a good thing in any sport.

i meant to reply to this yesterday, but i was getting a pedicure and typing on my phone at the time was difficult. (hence the typos in the previous post.)

i agree on how we did this year is a the reason to not fire mainieri. it would be silly to do so. my saying that alleva making me hesitate is pretty much no matter what the circumstances. you throw in getting to a super, it would be like firing miles after going 11-1 and making it to the seccg.

but that doesnt mean there arent problems that need to be addressed. and one of the most glaring is with the batting. as you pointed out we have a bunch of small guys and no real power hitters, and are one dimensional. we have no patience at the plate. some of that is recruiting and philosophy, some of it is coaching.

so. the recruiting and philosophy is on the hc, who isnt gonna change, and i agree should get more time. i have said throughout this thread that i dont want to go there yet. but mainieri himself has to change in his approach to baseball, including how he recruits. will he? can he? one thing that bothered me about his quote of a hitting coach not being important, that guys can hit or they cant bothers me because as a team, we cant! period! our pitching kept us in it this year. and to me, if he recognizes we have no bats (i honestly dont know if he does or not), then he is laying it on the players (imo) and that rubs me the wrong way.

the other part, the part of the team has no patience at the plate. that to me could be corrected through coaching. is it gonna correct the other problems at batting, the ones listed above? no. but do you just sit back and hope mainieri changes? or do you change even small parts hoping that will give some improvement? because the bats have to change. as you pointed out, we lose gausman. i have no idea what our pitching will be like next year, but if we dont have three solid starters, and knowing we are gonna be replacing some key defensive starters that back them, we could find ourselves in trouble defensively. i hope not, but there is the potential. we HAVE to have better bats to back the pitching. otherwise, we are gonna have a repeat of last season where we didnt even reach post season play.

but, when it comes down to it, this is a moot discussion. it has been made clear to fans that there will be no coaching change. so we all better cross our fingers and toes that the coaches learn to change.

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or do you change even small parts hoping that will give some improvement?

i'm not a big fan of firing the wrong guy just for the sake of change.

batting has been an issue, but our biggest weakness this year isn't going to be fixed by coaching.

we hit grounders and soft liners.

there ain't many guys in MLB, let alone college who can place those types of hit so precisely that no one on the other team catches them.

and with a guy on 1st, a grounder (our specialty) is going to result in a twin killing.

so how do you avoid the dp?

well you could steal 2nd, but our team speed is lacking, so we ain't real good at it.

you could hit and run to get the defense moving, but again, lack of team speed made our runners sitting ducks on bad pitches our hitter couldn't connect with.

only other option is to bunt him over, which we did with some success, but you can't can't do this exclusively.

and paul absolutely CAN change his philosophy.

he's done it multiple times now.

next year, he needs to change it to one that fits his roster.

in 2009, we had a GREAT roster, and we played a near flawless combo of prototypical station to station and gorillaball.

in 2011, we had the classic "station to station" type roster. yet we played small ball WAAAAY too much. it wasn't the team's strength, and it cost them.

in 2012, we have a roster better suited to play mostly small ball, yet he seemed to call a game as if it was constructed like the 1997 team. "phuck it! swing away!"

so we've seen multiple seasonal strategies from him.

only once did his style match his roster.

he needs to figure out a way to match his roster more often, or his seat will start to heat up mighty quickly.

he's already been given more leeway than Smoke ever got.

the end results of this season are a step in the right direction.

we can't go backwards next year (although I see it as a potential rebuilding year with a record closer to 2011 than 2012).

Edited by Nutriaitch

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and paul absolutely CAN change his philosophy.

he's done it multiple times now.

next year, he needs to change it to one that fits his roster.

then i hope he does.

the end results of this season are a step in the right direction.

we can't go backwards next year (although I see it as a potential rebuilding year with a record closer to 2011 than 2012).

because if not, i agree that we could see another 2011 where we dont even make the post season. unless young guys come on to fill the gaps in some big ways, we are not gonna have a defense that can make up for the lack of bats.

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Some bad news for the future: LSU commitment for the 2013 recruiting class Justin Williams (a kid I cover for my dayjob) is playing summerball in Minnesota and is shooting up the rankings; is now the No. 4 high school prospect in America and will likely be a first round draft pick.

There goes another one.

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Some bad news for the future: LSU commitment for the 2013 recruiting class Justin Williams (a kid I cover for my dayjob) is playing summerball in Minnesota and is shooting up the rankings; is now the No. 4 high school prospect in America and will likely be a first round draft pick.

There goes another one.

sucks, but we still gotta keep going after and offering kids like that.

don't remember his name, but there is a kid going to UNC next year that was considered to be a 1st rounder by just about every projection service out there this year.

he went undrafted.

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The good thing is the kid seems adament that he wants to go to school. So maybe if he says that loud enough to the right people, it will drop his stock. But if they get this guy to campus, he's the real deal. A left-handed hitting outfielder who can hit for power, but can steal bases. He's like Leon Landry in a lot of ways.

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Without reading this whole thread I just want to say that I don't understand the need to "want" to fire someone every time LSU doesn't win a championship. We won the SEC, won a regional and lost in 3 games in a super regional, to a good unknown team. It's college baseball, it's not like we can fire someone and expect someone better to be waiting in line to get hired.

Let's dissect this a little more. I think there are what? 210-211 D1 college baseball teams? I don't even know if SWAC baseball is considered D1, but they get a team in the regionals. My point is that we were one of the top 16 teams in the nation. Honestly, Stony Brook almost beat us in only two games, but we managed to pull out a win in the first game, but compare our regular season results with every other team in the nation. Is there any other school that completely dominated against a pretty solid schedule? The college baseball today is not the same college baseball we became familiar with in the 90s. Bats sizes have changed, there are more school competing for the same talent, along with the MLB than before, etc. To be honest, I think the fans should be thankful we are still as relevant as we are.

There is no question I am all for the fans keeping the pressure on because that check and balance is needed, but do it with some common sense. Why does it have to be one extreme to the other? Fans should learn how to enjoy the season without getting so bent out of shape over everything. When you are one of those people that starts "demanding" drastic changes after an overall successful season others start to not take what you say (about the topic) as series.

Just take a minutes to compare what is going on at LSU with other universities before going off the deep end.

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oweo, this is not about how we ended the season. although that didnt help. some of us have been saying all season we were "not so good" at the plate.

did you see cause for a change in the co-def coordinator status in football? want crowton gone on the offensive side?

after last season, we replaced grewe with dunn, and there was an improvement in pitching. imo, pitching is what kept us in, and won, a lot of games. maybe it is coincidence, but i think that the change in the pitching coach had something to do with that. now, some of us want to see an improvement in the bats. maybe nootch is right, and maybe mainieri can get them turned around with a change in recruiting a coaching philosophy. (i hope so because bottom line is that there are not going to be coaching changes.) but if something doesnt change on the offensive side of the game, it could bite us in the ass.

there are deficiencies offensively, no matter how many games we won, or that we won the sec and made it to the regionals. this is about improvement. just as in fb, hiring chavis improved the defense, and the team was on an upward swing, but there were still deficiencies in offensive production. would you have rather we kept crow, and hope the defense kept us in games, or did you want to see better offensive production?

Edited by OkieTigerTK

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I understand what you are saying, but I think we have to give coaches enough time to improve. I just think that a HC will make the decisions he feels best for his team.. After all, he knows them better than anyone, not to mention his job is on the line if he doesn't make the decisions he feels is best for the team and its ability to be successful. Even the most successful team will have its weaknesses. I guess my point is that as long as we have a team that can compete year after year and and be in position to have a chance to make it to Omaha on a regular basis, there isn't much more to ask for.

Again, we became use of the 1990s baseball, when there wasn't even a super regional, but now we have to go through another round before making it to Omaha. That alone has made the odds of us getting there as often as we once did go down. And even with problems as the plate, we still had the best hitter in the country. Of course he went into a slump towards the end, but that was something that was inevitable, it just sucks when that slump comes in the post season instead of the middle of the season, but at the same time, you can argue that his batting played a big role in getting us where we ended up being, but will say that as for as the team's success under the established law of average under Mainieri, it seems to be more about timing than anything.

What I mean is that under Mainieri, it is realistic to expect to be one of the better teams in the SEC and get to a regional. On average, that's where we are under Mainieri and therefore; every year this team will always be somewhere between getting to Omaha and just missing a regional. With the extreme obviously being winning a championship and having an awful season. If there is a drop in that average and LSU starts becoming in the middle of the pack in the SEC and not getting into a regional more than getting into one the

The law of average is something you can't get away from especially in baseball and I think LSU is on par with the average they maintain. That average is being one of the better teams in the SEC and making a regional. If we host a regional then our chances obviously improve on getting to a super regional, but at that point it is a coin toss.

There are 3 SEC teams on Omaha which doesn't include LSU and Kentucky. As good as Kentucky was this year, they lost their regional to KENT ST. I am not a huge baseball fan, but to expect us to be in Omaha every year is not realistic. This is just my opinion, but I think we are an as solid program as we can be. Of course there are things that we can improve on, but in reality, I think if drastic changes were made, we would have a better chance at not being as good of a team than seeing a drastic improvement.

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been a season ticket holder for 12 years and it's looking more like smoke laval is back

i don't know if i would go quite that far.

i do like CPM as both a coach and a person.

can't say the same for Smoke.

just seems that CPM can't figure out who he wants his team to be.

but give him credit for trying.

he moves people around in the lineup and in the field.

and he's changed his philosophy a few times now.

he just can't seem to get the right roster with the right game style.

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been a season ticket holder for 12 years and it's looking more like smoke laval is back

Are you kidding me? I guess everyone just got spoiled under Skip. Wow.

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Are you kidding me? I guess everyone just got spoiled under Skip. Wow.

Not spoiled under Skip but i think Manieri could take some lessons on how to produce good teams. I guess Manieri throwing his players under the bus was ok with you.,

To state that a hitting coach is overrated is just crazy , if that title is overrated then why pay his godson Javi a high salary , just get rid of the man and save the school money.,per wbrz news chad sadabie.

Edited by lsufan56

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Are you kidding me? I guess everyone just got spoiled under Skip. Wow.

i'm not spoiled at all.

but I do expect us to be competitive every year.

in 6 years, half of those , we finished a lot closer to the bottom of the SEC than the top.

that is not being competitive.

this season was absolutely good enough to keep everyone employed this year.

but we can all see the weakspots in this team/staff

they are some of the same problems that have been around a few years now.

and now, looking ahead, our roster/lineup/pitching staff does not look to be as good next year as it was this year (depending who steps up to fill some very key roles).

if those flaws aren't addressed and fixed, we could be in for a LONG season next year.

defense and pitching helped cover up the lack of bats.

in 2011, our bats were also weak.

but thanks to pitching and defense being well below what we saw in 2011, we finished 9th, and missed the SEC tourney.

missing the SEC and postseason entirely is simply unacceptable in a sport where very few schools dedicate even a fraction of the resources we do.

losing to Stony Brook hurts.

but not because of them being "unknown".

they are a VERY good, well constructed, well coached team.

they managed to put themselves in this position despite nearly every disadvantage in the book.

they've only been Div 1 for less than a decade.

they operate in a part of the country where nearly no one even knows college baseball exists, let alone supports it.

they are a cold weather school, which limits practice time and early season home games.

we should never look at a school like that and say

"Man, their roster is simply better than ours, and they seem to be better coached."

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i'm not spoiled at all.

but I do expect us to be competitive every year.

in 6 years, half of those , we finished a lot closer to the bottom of the SEC than the top.

that is not being competitive.

this season was absolutely good enough to keep everyone employed this year.

but we can all see the weakspots in this team/staff

they are some of the same problems that have been around a few years now.

and now, looking ahead, our roster/lineup/pitching staff does not look to be as good next year as it was this year (depending who steps up to fill some very key roles).

if those flaws aren't addressed and fixed, we could be in for a LONG season next year.

defense and pitching helped cover up the lack of bats.

in 2011, our bats were also weak.

but thanks to pitching and defense being well below what we saw in 2011, we finished 9th, and missed the SEC tourney.

missing the SEC and postseason entirely is simply unacceptable in a sport where very few schools dedicate even a fraction of the resources we do.

losing to Stony Brook hurts.

but not because of them being "unknown".

they are a VERY good, well constructed, well coached team.

they managed to put themselves in this position despite nearly every disadvantage in the book.

they've only been Div 1 for less than a decade.

they operate in a part of the country where nearly no one even knows college baseball exists, let alone supports it.

they are a cold weather school, which limits practice time and early season home games.

we should never look at a school like that and say

"Man, their roster is simply better than ours, and they seem to be better coached."

i agree and not recruiting well, and not being competetive is not what is expected from a program like lsu,and doing some roster changes isn't going to fix the problem.

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