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fredsez

Penn State Precedent

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A new ball game for college athletic departments. What happened at Penn State was horrible and Penn State allowing it to go unreported to the proper authorities in inexcusable. Now, If an athletic department has an employee who exhibits any kind of criminal behavior (drinking and driving, ect.) and they do nothing about it will mean the department will have to deal not only with criminal and civil courts, but the NCAA as well.

Your thoughts?

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The NCAA attacked the culture of Ped St., nit the actual criminal act.

We may never (hopefully) see a situation like this again.

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The NCAA attacked the culture of Ped St., nit the actual criminal act.

if the peds had done something other than cover up and enable, i dont think the ncaa would have stepped in. if psu had addressed the issue and dealt with it when it came to light, and let criminal and civil actions happen, then it would have been a black eye, but blown over. it was just a flat out cover up by the university, from top to bottom. i agree with nootch, it wasnt sandusky that caused the ncaa to come down, it was the cover up and allowing crimes to continue.

i think the lesson to all other schools here, is when something happens, DEAL WITH IT! dont sweep it under the rug! as long as schools do that, i dont think the ncaa steps in at all.

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It was worse than a coverup. The University cooperated fully with the crime.

Edited by Stevescookin

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It was worse than a coverup. The University cooperated fully with the crime.

very true. i have been saying in the ped state topic in the college sports forum that they enabled sandusky. gave him the keys (literally) for his main tool to lure kids into his trap and groom them. access to the psu football program.

but all of that, the enabling and the cover up, is what got them. not sandusky. had they done the right thing to begin with, the ncaa would not have stepped in. so that is the lesson. dont cover up (or enable) the crimes that happen within your program.

Edited by OkieTigerTK

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ok, now that i'm on an actual computer instead of my phone, I can dive further into this one.

this penalty has nothing to do with the actual crimes committed by Sandusky.

this has everything in the world to do with lack of compliance and institutional control.

this is Ped St. football getting so big, that they would do the unthinkable (cover-up, enable, and give free reign to a pedophile) just to avoid bad press for their beloved team.

this is about one man's (JoePed) legacy and reputation being held in higher esteem than even basic human decency.

this not just a punishment for Ped St.

this is also a warning shot across the bow of the entire college athletics landscape.

we cannot put football, or football coaches on such a pedestal, that protecting them takes priority of protecting the physical and emotional well being of innocent children.

they didn't just allow him to continue raping these boys.

they willingly gave him the keys to the building he was raping them in.

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if the peds had done something other than cover up and enable, i dont think the ncaa would have stepped in. if psu had addressed the issue and dealt with it when it came to light, and let criminal and civil actions happen, then it would have been a black eye, but blown over. it was just a flat out cover up by the university, from top to bottom. i agree with nootch, it wasnt sandusky that caused the ncaa to come down, it was the cover up and allowing crimes to continue.

i think the lesson to all other schools here, is when something happens, DEAL WITH IT! dont sweep it under the rug! as long as schools do that, i dont think the ncaa steps in at all.

Exactly! Nice post Okie!

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but all of that, the enabling and the cover up, is what got them. not sandusky. had they done the right thing to begin with, the ncaa would not have stepped in. so that is the lesson. dont cover up (or enable) the crimes that happen within your program.

I could not agree more. I just posted something eerily similar in another topic. I've listened to idiots on the radio all day try to compare this to other cases like Arky and Petrino..."why didn't the NCAA legislate morality in that situation"?? Because ARKANSAS DID!!! IMMEDIATELY!!! They didn't let Petrino continue hiring every hot young blonde that applied for a job on the staff and run around on his wife, all the while neglecting his duties as football coach. They FIRED HIM...IMMEDIATELY. Why don't people get this??

It's why USC got it much MUCH worse than LSU. LSU FIRED MacArthy and Hicks never played a down, and was kicked out...IMMEDIATELY. LSU policed themselves. LSU is the one that REPORTED the issue to the NCAA, because they weren't HIDING ANYTHING. They operated transparently instead of running around breaking all kinds of other rules just to cover up this one rule that was broken.

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Now, If an athletic department has an employee who exhibits any kind of criminal behavior (drinking and driving, ect.) and they do nothing about it will mean the department will have to deal not only with criminal and civil courts, but the NCAA as well.

Your thoughts?

Ya know, I didn't even read your whole post until now.

Yes and No is the answer. They won't have to deal with the NCAA if they take care of the issue swiftly, and don't try to make a mockery of justice out of it. Police themselves, and the NCAA...might snoop around...but the NCAA has shown us that if it sees you policed yourself properly, it will display leniancy.

I may be mistaken, (but I'm pretty sure I'm not), but LSU's SELF IMPOSED penalties were not only accepted by the NCAA, but LESSENED. LSU showed the NCAA it was doing MORE than enough to police itself. So the NCAA slapped us on the wrist and said "you guys have done enough...no need to do it another year like you planned".

That's all they want. Self policing.

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what's bad about this is the athletes will suffer,at the expense of a few horrible people in the administration.

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While I do feel somewhat bad for the students that had nothing to do with what caused this, a question keeps coming up in my mind; If the football program was not placed on a pedestal that allowed the despicable acts, would they have enrolled there to begin with?

I don't know the answer. But even if it's a yes, I still don't put a fraction of blame on the NCAA.

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what's bad about this is the athletes will suffer,at the expense of a few horrible people in the administration.

more was done to spare the current athletes than with any other ncaa sanctions i remember. they were given a transfer provision most dont get.

so if we are looking at precendents, how about that one? does that set precedent for allowing transfers of current athletes when a program gets sanctions for past actions?

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While I do feel somewhat bad for the students that had nothing to do with what caused this, a question keeps coming up in my mind; If the football program was not placed on a pedestal that allowed the despicable acts, would they have enrolled there to begin with?

I don't know the answer. But even if it's a yes, I still don't put a fraction of blame on the NCAA.

well that's a huge part of it. the program thought to be above reproach didn't even have it's own compliance dept. (how is that not an NCCA reg?)

therefore i think the effort to cover up and keep the institution's "good name" became more important that anything else.

the first question asked of Emmert was if this would set precedent on the NCAA ruling in such matters but he went out of his way to say this is a very unique and specific set of events.

much as the Saints were not really and truly punished for the bounty program as much as they were they were for the cover up.

PSU was punished for the cover up and lack of institutional control.

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Justin...I think they had excellent institutional control. They wouldn't have been able to maintain that dark secret for so long without that great control they had. It was just criminal control. I didn't see any lack of it.

And don't think for a minute that Emmert punished them just for the cover up. They weren't "unindicted co conspirators", "co conspirators".....they were perpetrators ... more like "co defendants". The other three have their separate trials coming up.

Penn State University itself was actually involved with criminal activity !!!

By the way, I saw your tweet that was re tweeted by La. Sports guy. !! :smiley-happy088:

Edited by Stevescookin

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Justin...I think they had excellent institutional control. They wouldn't have been able to maintain that dark secret for so long without that great control they had. It was just criminal control. I didn't see any lack of it.

And don't think for a minute that Emmert punished them just for the cover up. They weren't "unindicted co conspirators", "co conspirators".....they were perpetrators ... more like "co defendants". The other three have their separate trials coming up.

Penn State University itself was actually involved with criminal activity !!!

By the way, I saw your tweet that was re tweeted by La. Sports guy. !! :smiley-happy088:

well yeah but that's just semantics.

if sandusky did this for years and the no one else knew about it but himself and the victims, i don't think the NCAA would get involved and punish PSU for that. they punished PSU for (you're right, accomplice like behavior). like a friend of mine said, it's akin to standing by the door while a rape is going on so no one can interrupt.

and you can see my tweets directly ya know without being RT'ed. @tigertangents

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more was done to spare the current athletes than with any other ncaa sanctions i remember. they were given a transfer provision most dont get.

so if we are looking at precendents, how about that one? does that set precedent for allowing transfers of current athletes when a program gets sanctions for past actions?

Actually, that's nothing new.

Typically when a school gets a postseason ban any player whose eligibility will run out before the bowl ban ends is allowed to transfer without penalty.

In other words, since USC had a 2 year bowl ban, all their Junior and Senior players were allowed this same transfer.

The difference is that this particular ban lasts the entire eligibility time of everyone on the team.

That's why it's extended to the entire team.

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since USC had a 2 year bowl ban, all their Junior and Senior players were allowed this same transfer.

The difference is that this particular ban lasts the entire eligibility time of everyone on the team.

That's why it's extended to the entire team.

i wasnt considering the length. i was only thinking of it being the entire team. that is what i did not remember. my bad.

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